Emmisions Help

Snowryder · 07-11-06, 02:52 AM

Well I failed emissions twice so far and I thought I’d post my results.

Test 1

2.40 Hydrocarbon
.80 is the standard

89 Carbon Monoxide
15 is the standard

Test 2 (O2 sensor replaced)

2.20 Hydrocarbon
.80 is the standard

81 Carbon Monoxide
15 is the standard

So the Hydrocarbons went down by .2 and the CO decreased by 8 with the rear O2 sensor replaced. I replaced it myself because I was getting a rear O2 sensor code. The code is now gone. So I’m thinking it might be the cat, I’m still getting about 320 miles on a full tank. Could a bad cat make my car fail this badly? As of right now my car is in the shop, I'll post any updates I get. How much is a reasonable price for a Cat? Any suggestions guys?

gchrocknj · 07-11-06, 03:22 AM

related question..

I failed emissions for this:

CO%
standard: 0.88
reading: 1.45

anyone know what i'd have to replace to pass?

Mouse · 07-11-06, 03:46 AM

Have you guys replaced or confirm that these are working properly:

1) sparkplugs
2) sparkplug wires
3) air filter
4) PCV valve
5) TW sensor (coolant temperature sensor)

Also make sure the engine is warmed up before getting tested.

slartibartfast · 07-11-06, 12:20 PM

If you're failing all three tests, that's a pretty good indicator the cat is tits up.

Snowryder · 07-11-06, 08:28 PM

Alright so i got a call from the shop, and they want $1,700 for parts and labor. This includes Cat, Resonator, Sparkplugs, Sparkplug wires, Distributor cap, Front O2 sensor, and some cleaning being done..... WTF So thats not gonna happen. Besides i can do all the sparkplug and distributor stuff myself. I think i will be buying a cat online for $50 and then installing it at a shop i know for 40.

What you guys think?

Also i dont need a resonator to pass emmisions and the resonator is after the Cat so that seems like wasted money. (Also there are no exhaust leaks)

Here are some Cats, Which sound good?

Magnaflow Catalytic Converter

Eastern Catalytic Converter

Legend Catalytic Converter MagnaFlow

Also wondering if our exhaust is 2 inches?

Mouse · 07-11-06, 10:00 PM

$50 seems too cheap to be true. Are you sure this stuff is any good?
Btw, does your car also have a slight jerk when you accelerate?
I have that problem and have been wondering if it's my cat. also.

Snowryder · 07-11-06, 10:03 PM

Could you explain your jerk alittle more? and is this under full acceleration or just a faster pace.
The cat is a universal so i hope it will be alright, it comes with a 50,000 5 year warranty and is bran new, has anyone else used any universals?

pnoye2 · 07-12-06, 12:43 AM

Hydrocarbons (HC) are essentially fuel which was not burned during the combustion process, main sources of incomplete combustion are rich air/fuel mixtures, low engine temperature and improper spark timing.

And, an increase in the Carbon Monoxide (CO) emission is normally accompanied by the increase of hydrocarbon (HC) emission because of the lack of air to completely burn all fuel mixture.

Yea, a full tune-up is recommended (if you hadn't done so)... doing this will narrow down all the possibilities when you actually fail the emission test.

I'd also agree with new cat, universal cat will do just fine (got one from a local muffler shop) goodluck!

1990Legend_LS_5spd · 07-12-06, 12:51 AM

might have a vacuum leak. look into that and also it might be a good idea to have your injectors cleaned.

Snowryder · 07-12-06, 01:10 AM

Thanks a lot for the help guys, I went ahead and ordered the Cat at a diameter of 2 inches. Can anyone verify that this is the correct pipe size?

Thanks for all the suggestions and i will look into each of them, Is there a way to check my spark plugs and wires? Ill look at my vacuum lines tomarrow as well.

Edit: Alright the Cat is in and i'll be testing it tomarrow so if all goes well i hope ill pass. *Crosses fingures*

Snowryder · 07-17-06, 06:53 PM

Alright so here is the new results.

Test 3 (Cat Replaced)

.99 Hydrocarbon
.80 is the standard

46.4 Carbon Monoxide
15.0 is the standard

and here is the second test to compare it too.

Test 2 (O2 sensor replaced)

2.20 Hydrocarbon
.80 is the standard

81 Carbon Monoxide
15 is the standard

So the CO was cut in half after the cat was put in and the HC dropped ~1.3 which is almost passing now.

I think i'm going to put a multimeter to the front O2 sensor to make sure it has a solid reading and if so i think ill replace the sparkplugs and wires.

What you guys think? Any suggestions?

Alperovich · 07-17-06, 06:57 PM

almost there huh... (to passing)

Mouse · 07-17-06, 07:02 PM

You work fast Snowryder.
Btw, don't they also test for Nox also?

Snowryder · 07-17-06, 07:07 PM

Thanks man, nah just CO and HC in Illinois. btw is there a way to test the plugs?

Mouse · 07-18-06, 01:53 AM

Then you are very lucky because Nox can be troublesome as well.
About the sparkplugs, why test? They're cheap, just get new ones. You should change them every other year anyway.

07-11-06, 02:52 AM	#1 (permalink)
Snowryder Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 148 Car 1: 1990 Legend LS Coupe 80k miles iTrader: (0)	Emmisions Help Well I failed emissions twice so far and I thought I’d post my results. Test 1 2.40 Hydrocarbon .80 is the standard 89 Carbon Monoxide 15 is the standard Test 2 (O2 sensor replaced) 2.20 Hydrocarbon .80 is the standard 81 Carbon Monoxide 15 is the standard So the Hydrocarbons went down by .2 and the CO decreased by 8 with the rear O2 sensor replaced. I replaced it myself because I was getting a rear O2 sensor code. The code is now gone. So I’m thinking it might be the cat, I’m still getting about 320 miles on a full tank. Could a bad cat make my car fail this badly? As of right now my car is in the shop, I'll post any updates I get. How much is a reasonable price for a Cat? Any suggestions guys? __________________ 1990 LS Legend Coupe, http://photobucket.com/albums/a272/C...th_Testgap.gif Parkour... Get with the flow... Last edited by Snowryder : 07-17-06 at 06:54 PM.

07-11-06, 12:20 PM	#4 (permalink)
slartibartfast Bitter Old Man Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: La Porte, Texas Posts: 687 Car 1: 1990 Legend LS sedan Car 2: 2002 Dakota SLT QC Car 3: 1998 Bandit 1200S iTrader: (0)	If you're failing all three tests, that's a pretty good indicator the cat is tits up. __________________ Bruce in Houston 2007 Mazda MX-5 Touring 2002 Dodge Dakota QC tow beast, stock! 1998 Suzuki Bandit 1200S w/ $tuff 1994 Nissan Sentra SE-R w/ $tuff converting to ITA 1990 Acura Legend LS sedan leaving the stable

07-11-06, 08:28 PM	#5 (permalink)
Snowryder Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 148 Car 1: 1990 Legend LS Coupe 80k miles iTrader: (0)	Alright so i got a call from the shop, and they want $1,700 for parts and labor. This includes Cat, Resonator, Sparkplugs, Sparkplug wires, Distributor cap, Front O2 sensor, and some cleaning being done..... WTF So thats not gonna happen. Besides i can do all the sparkplug and distributor stuff myself. I think i will be buying a cat online for $50 and then installing it at a shop i know for 40. What you guys think? Also i dont need a resonator to pass emmisions and the resonator is after the Cat so that seems like wasted money. (Also there are no exhaust leaks) Here are some Cats, Which sound good? Magnaflow Catalytic Converter Eastern Catalytic Converter Legend Catalytic Converter MagnaFlow Also wondering if our exhaust is 2 inches? __________________ 1990 LS Legend Coupe, http://photobucket.com/albums/a272/C...th_Testgap.gif Parkour... Get with the flow...

07-11-06, 10:03 PM	#7 (permalink)
Snowryder Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 148 Car 1: 1990 Legend LS Coupe 80k miles iTrader: (0)	Could you explain your jerk alittle more? and is this under full acceleration or just a faster pace. The cat is a universal so i hope it will be alright, it comes with a 50,000 5 year warranty and is bran new, has anyone else used any universals? __________________ 1990 LS Legend Coupe, http://photobucket.com/albums/a272/C...th_Testgap.gif Parkour... Get with the flow...

07-12-06, 12:43 AM	#8 (permalink)
pnoye2 Wowoweeee Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Laguna Hills, California Posts: 3,278 Car 1: '89 Sedan w/Auto (base model) iTrader: (0)	Hydrocarbons (HC) are essentially fuel which was not burned during the combustion process, main sources of incomplete combustion are rich air/fuel mixtures, low engine temperature and improper spark timing. And, an increase in the Carbon Monoxide (CO) emission is normally accompanied by the increase of hydrocarbon (HC) emission because of the lack of air to completely burn all fuel mixture. Yea, a full tune-up is recommended (if you hadn't done so)... doing this will narrow down all the possibilities when you actually fail the emission test. I'd also agree with new cat, universal cat will do just fine (got one from a local muffler shop) goodluck! __________________ 291K+ miles; original power/drive trains

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07-11-06, 03:22 AM	#2 (permalink)
gchrocknj Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Cherry Hill, NJ Posts: 54 Car 1: 1990 Acura Legend LS iTrader: (0)	related question.. I failed emissions for this: CO% standard: 0.88 reading: 1.45 anyone know what i'd have to replace to pass?

07-11-06, 03:46 AM	#3 (permalink)
Mouse Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: portland Posts: 36 Car 1: 1990 Acura Legend L Coupe iTrader: (0)	Have you guys replaced or confirm that these are working properly: 1) sparkplugs 2) sparkplug wires 3) air filter 4) PCV valve 5) TW sensor (coolant temperature sensor) Also make sure the engine is warmed up before getting tested.

07-11-06, 10:00 PM	#6 (permalink)
Mouse Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: portland Posts: 36 Car 1: 1990 Acura Legend L Coupe iTrader: (0)	$50 seems too cheap to be true. Are you sure this stuff is any good? Btw, does your car also have a slight jerk when you accelerate? I have that problem and have been wondering if it's my cat. also.

07-12-06, 12:51 AM	#9 (permalink)
1990Legend_LS_5spd 5 Speed Operator Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Newport, VT Posts: 2,364 Car 1: 1990 White LS 5spd Sedan iTrader: (2)	might have a vacuum leak. look into that and also it might be a good idea to have your injectors cleaned. __________________ Originally Posted by Jrod@Buschur@ evowned.com DSM's..... turning the everyday Joe into a tool throwing, foul mouthed, alcoholic since 1989. 1990 Legend LS Sedan 5 spd 1989 Legend LS Sedan Auto(For Parts, Bad Trans) G1 FAQ If Your Legend Stalls or Doesnt Start, CLICK HERE

07-12-06, 01:10 AM	#10 (permalink)
Snowryder Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 148 Car 1: 1990 Legend LS Coupe 80k miles iTrader: (0)	Thanks a lot for the help guys, I went ahead and ordered the Cat at a diameter of 2 inches. Can anyone verify that this is the correct pipe size? Thanks for all the suggestions and i will look into each of them, Is there a way to check my spark plugs and wires? Ill look at my vacuum lines tomarrow as well. Edit: Alright the Cat is in and i'll be testing it tomarrow so if all goes well i hope ill pass. Crosses fingures __________________ 1990 LS Legend Coupe, http://photobucket.com/albums/a272/C...th_Testgap.gif Parkour... Get with the flow... Last edited by Snowryder : 07-17-06 at 01:29 AM.

07-17-06, 06:53 PM	#11 (permalink)
Snowryder Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 148 Car 1: 1990 Legend LS Coupe 80k miles iTrader: (0)	Alright so here is the new results. Test 3 (Cat Replaced) .99 Hydrocarbon .80 is the standard 46.4 Carbon Monoxide 15.0 is the standard and here is the second test to compare it too. Test 2 (O2 sensor replaced) 2.20 Hydrocarbon .80 is the standard 81 Carbon Monoxide 15 is the standard So the CO was cut in half after the cat was put in and the HC dropped ~1.3 which is almost passing now. I think i'm going to put a multimeter to the front O2 sensor to make sure it has a solid reading and if so i think ill replace the sparkplugs and wires. What you guys think? Any suggestions? __________________ 1990 LS Legend Coupe, http://photobucket.com/albums/a272/C...th_Testgap.gif Parkour... Get with the flow...

07-17-06, 06:57 PM	#12 (permalink)
Alperovich I'm the Stig! Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Highland park, il Posts: 13,984 Car 1: 94 DM GS Car 2: 93 Coupe LS 6SPD :( Car 3: 99 2.3CL 5spd iTrader: (19)	almost there huh... (to passing) __________________ ~Alex \

07-17-06, 07:02 PM	#13 (permalink)
Mouse Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: portland Posts: 36 Car 1: 1990 Acura Legend L Coupe iTrader: (0)	You work fast Snowryder. Btw, don't they also test for Nox also?

07-17-06, 07:07 PM	#14 (permalink)
Snowryder Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 148 Car 1: 1990 Legend LS Coupe 80k miles iTrader: (0)	Thanks man, nah just CO and HC in Illinois. btw is there a way to test the plugs? __________________ 1990 LS Legend Coupe, http://photobucket.com/albums/a272/C...th_Testgap.gif Parkour... Get with the flow...

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07-18-06, 01:53 AM	#15 (permalink)
Mouse Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: portland Posts: 36 Car 1: 1990 Acura Legend L Coupe iTrader: (0)	Then you are very lucky because Nox can be troublesome as well. About the sparkplugs, why test? They're cheap, just get new ones. You should change them every other year anyway.