NSX 6speed in Legends

Cheesyb · 05-02-02, 06:10 PM

I was at the Acura dealer the other day and I was talking with one of the reps about my 6speed. He was telling me that the 6speed was either based on or almost identical to the one that is in the NSX. Have any of you guys heard anything about the background of this trans? He sure spoke highly of it and I must agree....hell of a transmission.

**B+O** · 05-02-02, 07:12 PM

though it is one hell of a transaxle it's not the NSXs trans. the NSX has a transversely(sic?) mounted 6 and with that you need a transversely mounted trans. the legends engine is longitudinally mounted the trans works like a porsches in reverse. im not sure of the internal gears if they are the same but the actual trans housing, linkages, cables, plugs, shift forks.....knives(j/k), etc. all are unique to the legend.

ChrisK · 05-02-02, 09:00 PM

Like metiononed above, NSX is transverse, while ours is not. Anyway, If there is any sort of truth to that, it would be that the NSX 6-Speed trans was based of the Legend 6-Speed trans. The Legend has a 6-Speed 4 years before the NSX did.

theGodfather · 05-02-02, 10:20 PM

Perhaps the Legend was fitted wiht a 6-speed to test out and R&D a tranny in the market for a few years before putting it into their produciton sports car.

We do share the same dual-mass flywheel and many interior components of the tranny itself are the same.

G

Alexander · 05-02-02, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by theGodfather
Perhaps the Legend was fitted wiht a 6-speed to test out and R&D a tranny in the market for a few years before putting it into their produciton sports car.

We do share the same dual-mass flywheel and many interior components of the tranny itself are the same.

G

Yep, I believe our legend 6-speed, especially the 93 Coupe was the guinea pig for Honda. It will be less embarassing having a failed tranny on a legend than on Honda's flagship exotic sportscar, hehehhee.............

LeoLegendATL · 05-03-02, 12:54 AM

The only thing that I can tell you is that the NSX gearbox is one of the best gearboxes in the world. Comprable to Porsche, BMW, etc.. I have driven different types of 6 spds, and the NSX remains my favorite. So if it does have resemblence we are quite lucky!

1994 ls coupe · 05-03-02, 02:04 AM

Ok guys.

We would all love it if the 6 speed transmissions in the legend were the same as the nsx or the the "test bed" for the nsx. But unfortunately none of this is true.

When I went to purchase my legend coupe I really wanted to buy a 6 speed coupe. I drove 3 of them (6 speed coupe's) 1 95 ls and two 1994 l's. Funny thing happend. On all three of them (with miles ranging from 50K to 100K) when i tested the clutch by taking the engine to 6K in first and then shifting right to 4th (to test the clutches ability to hold) they all slipped like mad (for 3 to 4 seconds) until I let off the throttle.

The reason I test drove three of them was I thought after the first and second car that I just had been unlucky and found two cars with worn clutches. After the 3rd experience i called a couple of acura dealors and asked to speech with their best techs about manual tranny's. What I was told is a) the legend 6 speed is a derivative of the legend 5 speed. b) the legend 5 speed tranny actually is better and more reliable due to having less issues with the clutch. c) the 6 speed has been known to have trouble with the hp of the type 2 motor and to prematurly go through clutches and pressure plates. d) the clutch and pressure plate job on this car is upwards of 1200.00 (the pressure plate needs to be replaced and cannot be resurfaced). e) the 6 spd is not a sporty (close ratio) tranny. It is actually a 3 speed with 4th 5th and 6th as overdrives. (someone can post the ratios of each of the gear ratios on a 6speed legend verses a 6 speed nsx (close ratio) or 92-93 (first generation integra gsr) .. the nsx and gsr are the only hondas (short of the s2000 and new cl /tl type s ) to have close ratio manuals.

The bottom line from acura was that the 6 speed in the legend is a transmission adapted from the 5 speed legend and designed for economy (not sport).

the techs (working for acura) stopped short of saying anything bad about the tranny. It is very good for it's indended purpose (a feeling of sport by letting you manually select the gears) but is for economy.

They did however each ask me if i had driven a type 2 legend with the auto tranny and if so why i was so set on a 6 speed legend. This information was really disapointing to me as I had my heart set on a 6 speed type 2. At this point I almost decided to buy a newer cl type s.. but after a couple of weeks of thinking I decided that I still loved the looks of the legend coupe and the extra features so I bit the bullet and bought my first automatic car in ten years.

While i still wonder how it would have been had i bought a 6 speed, i am happy with the auto.

Anyway... alll legends (first or second gen) type 1 or 2, coupe or sedan.. RULE

Tom

theGodfather · 05-03-02, 03:20 AM

Economy? And not sporty? Common man... I guess my "economy" car has something magic about it in order to beat "sportY" BMW engine/tranny combos, or many cars on the street for that matter. The gear ratios are tuned giving the advantage on higher speeds wehre many cars have hard time not seeing the tailights of a Legend.

Drop a peformance clutch into it and you will light up your tires from 6000rpm easily.

Sorry man but that is kinda hard to swallow. Not saying your wrong but I'm not convinced being a first hand driver.

G

ChrisK · 05-03-02, 03:39 AM

You want to talk about slipping clutches? Try checking some of the old posts on the NSX boards. While I personally believe premature worn clutches are a result of the driver, many of the NSX owners used to claim the NSX clutch only lasted about 5K miles, because many of them had to replace their clutches. I once read a topic on how to drive the manual NSX, and a few owners said to reve it to about 3K RPM, then slowly let the clutch out. No wonder their clutches only last 5K miles. I know of a NSX owner who bought a used NSX with only 50K miles on it and had a severely slipping clutch which he had replaced. Its not the tranny, its the drivers. I only have 85K miles on my clutch, but there is no sign of slipping at all. If the Legend was a test bed for the 6-Speed trannies, Honda did not learn anything. Many NSX owners used to talk about a slightly notchy 2nd gear. I know an S2000 owners to says the S2000 clutch in way too small for that car. The trannies themselves are good though. If the clutch is slipping, that is the fault of the driver. If the trannies are failing, that is a fault of the tranny (maybe). How many of us 6-Speed owners have had a tranny failure? I presume there has to be some, but nobody here has had one go yet.

Also, if the 6-Speed is based of the 5-Speed, than that is a good thing. I know some Acura techs mentioned the 5-Speed as being near bullet proof.

And as for the NSX close ratio gears, check the forums and you will find that one of the most complaints about the manual NSX is the 2nd gear is way too tall. That is why many are putting in the JDM short gears. Don't get me wrong, I fully intend to buy a nice used NSX within a few years, but one of the mods I am highly considering is changing the gears. IF I get teh 6-Speed NSX, than I might just change 4.55 pinion only.

theGodfather · 05-03-02, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisK
Many NSX owners used to talk about a slightly notchy 2nd gear.

I can relate to that on my 2nd gear.

Seems like the synchros don't like me too much when trying to downshift into 2nd, even in a non-aggresive manner (slowing down to make a right turn at an intersection and putting it into second to pull away).

I havn't changed my tranny fluid for awhile (18,000 mi) and hope putting Redline MT90 would help out alot.

G

jrock7791 · 05-03-02, 04:00 PM

Haven't heard that but thank you so much..I'm going to check into it now. I really want a six speed and unbenounced to you guys they don't/didn't produce 6 speed Legends here!! I've checked 8 Tokyo Honda dealers and no one ever heard of a six speed Legend other than in the states!! Again thanks alot I'm going start checking now!!!

LeoLegendATL · 05-03-02, 08:50 PM

I have read in R&Track that in order to make sure of a long lasting Acura clutch, you need to practice short precise engagements of the clutch. This was from a Owners Survey of the 91-99 NSX.

I have just recently had my clutch replaced. I went ahead and just got the OEM clutch job with costed 1100$!! That is a 5 spd, remember.. personally, I think the Legend clutch is a little light and weak for the weight and hp of the car.

asianlegend · 05-03-02, 09:44 PM

Thanks for making me feel good about my automatic!

You've been a great deal of help by making me stop wondering about what happens if I had a 6-Speed 94-95 L/LS/GS.

**502 MotorSports** · 05-03-02, 10:52 PM

I think I will go wit ha CLutchmasters stage III....Godfather, dont u have that?

pjslegend · 05-04-02, 12:19 AM

The Centerforce dual friction works well, that is what I have in my 5spd. Pedal preasure is about the same but the grip is much better.

05-02-02, 06:10 PM	#1 (permalink)
Cheesyb Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 25 iTrader: (0)	NSX 6speed in Legends I was at the Acura dealer the other day and I was talking with one of the reps about my 6speed. He was telling me that the 6speed was either based on or almost identical to the one that is in the NSX. Have any of you guys heard anything about the background of this trans? He sure spoke highly of it and I must agree....hell of a transmission.

05-02-02, 07:12 PM	#2 (permalink)
B+O The Mac vs. The Mack Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: VSC Moderator Posts: 12,416 Car 1: why? iTrader: (1)	though it is one hell of a transaxle it's not the NSXs trans. the NSX has a transversely(sic?) mounted 6 and with that you need a transversely mounted trans. the legends engine is longitudinally mounted the trans works like a porsches in reverse. im not sure of the internal gears if they are the same but the actual trans housing, linkages, cables, plugs, shift forks.....knives(j/k), etc. all are unique to the legend. __________________ "Untainted by Concept of Limitation" -BozzSpeed -Reiko my baby -The MAIN person Thank you Leon. Your words help God said it, and it was so. Forum Rules *flossin,* breakin off the intersection crossin RL'in, ackin a iz-ass on them bosses

05-02-02, 10:20 PM	#4 (permalink)
theGodfather "the Don" Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Toronto, ON, CANADA Posts: 1,002 Car 1: 1995 Carbon Black Metallic 6-Speed Coupe iTrader: (2)	Perhaps the Legend was fitted wiht a 6-speed to test out and R&D a tranny in the market for a few years before putting it into their produciton sports car. We do share the same dual-mass flywheel and many interior components of the tranny itself are the same. G __________________ 1995 Legend Coupe 6-speed Carbon Black Metallic 208 WHP @ 6250 RPM 189 FT/LB @ 5250 RPM MUSTANG Dyno 260,000mi and counting WeaponR Secret Weapon Intake - Cold Air Box - Custom 2.5" stainless exhaust system - Remus Rev3 Universal muffler -SPEC Stage II clutch - 5speed flywheel - SR5GUY Chip - APEXi S-AFC - Pullies - MLS copy strut bar - Short Shifter -18" ICON W65 Wheels - KONI reds/Ground Controls - Slotted Brembo Rotors - SS Brake lines - Walbro 255 -ICE

05-03-02, 12:54 AM	#6 (permalink)
LeoLegendATL S K / L L Z Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 1,153 Car 1: 91 LS coupe (boost coming soon! (or not)) iTrader: (0)	The only thing that I can tell you is that the NSX gearbox is one of the best gearboxes in the world. Comprable to Porsche, BMW, etc.. I have driven different types of 6 spds, and the NSX remains my favorite. So if it does have resemblence we are quite lucky! __________________ Peace, Legendary Legendz CC LegendaryLegendz.com http://images.snapfish.com/342%3A%3B...449%3A53ot1lsi INSPIRATION

05-03-02, 03:20 AM	#8 (permalink)
theGodfather "the Don" Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Toronto, ON, CANADA Posts: 1,002 Car 1: 1995 Carbon Black Metallic 6-Speed Coupe iTrader: (2)	Economy? And not sporty? Common man... I guess my "economy" car has something magic about it in order to beat "sportY" BMW engine/tranny combos, or many cars on the street for that matter. The gear ratios are tuned giving the advantage on higher speeds wehre many cars have hard time not seeing the tailights of a Legend. Drop a peformance clutch into it and you will light up your tires from 6000rpm easily. Sorry man but that is kinda hard to swallow. Not saying your wrong but I'm not convinced being a first hand driver. G __________________ 1995 Legend Coupe 6-speed Carbon Black Metallic 208 WHP @ 6250 RPM 189 FT/LB @ 5250 RPM MUSTANG Dyno 260,000mi and counting WeaponR Secret Weapon Intake - Cold Air Box - Custom 2.5" stainless exhaust system - Remus Rev3 Universal muffler -SPEC Stage II clutch - 5speed flywheel - SR5GUY Chip - APEXi S-AFC - Pullies - MLS copy strut bar - Short Shifter -18" ICON W65 Wheels - KONI reds/Ground Controls - Slotted Brembo Rotors - SS Brake lines - Walbro 255 -ICE

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05-02-02, 09:00 PM	#3 (permalink)
ChrisK 0000$$$$0000####0000 Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Hawaii Posts: 4,972 Car 1: Acura iTrader: (0)	Like metiononed above, NSX is transverse, while ours is not. Anyway, If there is any sort of truth to that, it would be that the NSX 6-Speed trans was based of the Legend 6-Speed trans. The Legend has a 6-Speed 4 years before the NSX did.

05-03-02, 02:04 AM	#7 (permalink)
1994 ls coupe Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: southern ca Posts: 13 iTrader: (0)	Ok guys. We would all love it if the 6 speed transmissions in the legend were the same as the nsx or the the "test bed" for the nsx. But unfortunately none of this is true. When I went to purchase my legend coupe I really wanted to buy a 6 speed coupe. I drove 3 of them (6 speed coupe's) 1 95 ls and two 1994 l's. Funny thing happend. On all three of them (with miles ranging from 50K to 100K) when i tested the clutch by taking the engine to 6K in first and then shifting right to 4th (to test the clutches ability to hold) they all slipped like mad (for 3 to 4 seconds) until I let off the throttle. The reason I test drove three of them was I thought after the first and second car that I just had been unlucky and found two cars with worn clutches. After the 3rd experience i called a couple of acura dealors and asked to speech with their best techs about manual tranny's. What I was told is a) the legend 6 speed is a derivative of the legend 5 speed. b) the legend 5 speed tranny actually is better and more reliable due to having less issues with the clutch. c) the 6 speed has been known to have trouble with the hp of the type 2 motor and to prematurly go through clutches and pressure plates. d) the clutch and pressure plate job on this car is upwards of 1200.00 (the pressure plate needs to be replaced and cannot be resurfaced). e) the 6 spd is not a sporty (close ratio) tranny. It is actually a 3 speed with 4th 5th and 6th as overdrives. (someone can post the ratios of each of the gear ratios on a 6speed legend verses a 6 speed nsx (close ratio) or 92-93 (first generation integra gsr) .. the nsx and gsr are the only hondas (short of the s2000 and new cl /tl type s ) to have close ratio manuals. The bottom line from acura was that the 6 speed in the legend is a transmission adapted from the 5 speed legend and designed for economy (not sport). the techs (working for acura) stopped short of saying anything bad about the tranny. It is very good for it's indended purpose (a feeling of sport by letting you manually select the gears) but is for economy. They did however each ask me if i had driven a type 2 legend with the auto tranny and if so why i was so set on a 6 speed legend. This information was really disapointing to me as I had my heart set on a 6 speed type 2. At this point I almost decided to buy a newer cl type s.. but after a couple of weeks of thinking I decided that I still loved the looks of the legend coupe and the extra features so I bit the bullet and bought my first automatic car in ten years. While i still wonder how it would have been had i bought a 6 speed, i am happy with the auto. Anyway... alll legends (first or second gen) type 1 or 2, coupe or sedan.. RULE Tom

05-03-02, 03:39 AM	#9 (permalink)
ChrisK 0000$$$$0000####0000 Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Hawaii Posts: 4,972 Car 1: Acura iTrader: (0)	You want to talk about slipping clutches? Try checking some of the old posts on the NSX boards. While I personally believe premature worn clutches are a result of the driver, many of the NSX owners used to claim the NSX clutch only lasted about 5K miles, because many of them had to replace their clutches. I once read a topic on how to drive the manual NSX, and a few owners said to reve it to about 3K RPM, then slowly let the clutch out. No wonder their clutches only last 5K miles. I know of a NSX owner who bought a used NSX with only 50K miles on it and had a severely slipping clutch which he had replaced. Its not the tranny, its the drivers. I only have 85K miles on my clutch, but there is no sign of slipping at all. If the Legend was a test bed for the 6-Speed trannies, Honda did not learn anything. Many NSX owners used to talk about a slightly notchy 2nd gear. I know an S2000 owners to says the S2000 clutch in way too small for that car. The trannies themselves are good though. If the clutch is slipping, that is the fault of the driver. If the trannies are failing, that is a fault of the tranny (maybe). How many of us 6-Speed owners have had a tranny failure? I presume there has to be some, but nobody here has had one go yet. Also, if the 6-Speed is based of the 5-Speed, than that is a good thing. I know some Acura techs mentioned the 5-Speed as being near bullet proof. And as for the NSX close ratio gears, check the forums and you will find that one of the most complaints about the manual NSX is the 2nd gear is way too tall. That is why many are putting in the JDM short gears. Don't get me wrong, I fully intend to buy a nice used NSX within a few years, but one of the mods I am highly considering is changing the gears. IF I get teh 6-Speed NSX, than I might just change 4.55 pinion only. Last edited by ChrisK : 05-03-02 at 03:47 AM.

05-03-02, 04:00 PM	#11 (permalink)
jrock7791 JDM Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Tokyo, Japan Posts: 722 Car 1: Previous Ride 1992 JDM Honda Legend (Now) 1995 Nissan 180 SX Turbo iTrader: (0)	Haven't heard that but thank you so much..I'm going to check into it now. I really want a six speed and unbenounced to you guys they don't/didn't produce 6 speed Legends here!! I've checked 8 Tokyo Honda dealers and no one ever heard of a six speed Legend other than in the states!! Again thanks alot I'm going start checking now!!! __________________ 1992 JDM Honda Legend Coupe (SOLD) 1995 Nissan 180 Turbo President and Co-Founder of Team Solo Japan jrock77@yta.attmil.ne.jp My 180 http://www.jrock7791.onlineshowoff.com The Legend http://www.jrock.50megs.com

05-03-02, 08:50 PM	#12 (permalink)
LeoLegendATL S K / L L Z Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 1,153 Car 1: 91 LS coupe (boost coming soon! (or not)) iTrader: (0)	I have read in R&Track that in order to make sure of a long lasting Acura clutch, you need to practice short precise engagements of the clutch. This was from a Owners Survey of the 91-99 NSX. I have just recently had my clutch replaced. I went ahead and just got the OEM clutch job with costed 1100$!! That is a 5 spd, remember.. personally, I think the Legend clutch is a little light and weak for the weight and hp of the car. __________________ Peace, Legendary Legendz CC LegendaryLegendz.com http://images.snapfish.com/342%3A%3B...449%3A53ot1lsi INSPIRATION

05-03-02, 09:44 PM	#13 (permalink)
asianlegend -!hnk Hard!- Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Middletown, NJ - Irvine, CA Posts: 1,048 Car 1: '03 Convertible & '98 Sedan iTrader: (0)	Thanks for making me feel good about my automatic! You've been a great deal of help by making me stop wondering about what happens if I had a 6-Speed 94-95 L/LS/GS. __________________ \| rick \| -- Ex-Legend owner by force -- My Clear By Day, Legal By Night was lost on March 14, 2003.

05-03-02, 10:52 PM	#14 (permalink)
502 MotorSports 502MotorSports.com Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: ATLVILLE Posts: 9,445 Car 1: e39 540i Car 2: e46 325xi \| e46 330i Car 3: S430 iTrader: (0)	I think I will go wit ha CLutchmasters stage III....Godfather, dont u have that? __________________ The Hotness! Elevate Your Standards.... Legend Mod Money! Jasmyn \| Final e39 Pics \| 502MotorSports MySpace

05-04-02, 12:19 AM	#15 (permalink)
pjslegend :) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Ewa Beach Hawaii Posts: 444 iTrader: (5)	The Centerforce dual friction works well, that is what I have in my 5spd. Pedal preasure is about the same but the grip is much better.

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