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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys and gals, first post to this board. Have been lurking and keeping up with the theads for the past 6 months. :D

Anyway, had a leak in my condenser and had it replaced. Also had R-12 converted over to R-134a.

Cost including labour, fitings, condenser and R-134a charge $500.

Not bad, considering that a new condenser from Acura costs $924 CDN and aftermarket cost $567 retail.

It blows really cold, but I'll have to update this thread when Toronto warms up and we get a nice 32 degree day again.

If anyone in the TO area wants more info, let me know and I'll forward you the mechanics info.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Well, since my post, my compressor went.
The clutch/bearing went. :(

Oh well, I knew it would go sometime, since last year it was making some noise.

200CDN to get it fixed. It looks like an easy repair (from the service manual), but I priced the parts and they come up to 160 anyway, so I'll go with the shop doing the repair and get a 90 warranty on it. :D

A/C was still very cold up to that point.
Will update when it is repaired and re-installed.
 

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Do you know what all was done to do the conversion?

I've converted a Mustang from R12 to R134 and it worked real well (40 F vent temp in TX). Wondering if an Acura would be the same?

The conversion consisted of replacing all o-rings, drier, draining the compressor and any lines that have mufflers on them, and flushing the other lines, condensor and evaporator. Then adding another kind of oil to the various components and charging until the high side pressure was 2.2-2.5 times the ambient temp in front of the compressor. There is a DIY a/c list that is real helpful. www.aircondition.com
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanx for the info. I have frequented that site many times.

The conversion went well, and I believe the system has no leaks and is still sealed.

It's just that time for the compressor to go I guess.
The guy who is going to replace the bearing, told me that he has done about 10 compressors in about 3 years. He said it's real easy, but the parts are a little high priced, that's why it costs $200.

Hopefully this will be the last expense on the A/C system.

Sorry, I didn't read the subject until this was posted.

I had the rec/dryer replaced, the system flushed, O-rings replaced, compressor removed and drained, Ester or PAG oil put in.
My condensor was leaking so I had to replace that. The fittings to convert the valves.
And of course R-134a pumped in.
 

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mixing oils -destory compressor/?

I fumbled and didn't read your post until after I put new orings and new r32 in without draining the old oil out of the compressor -

It worked for a few days cold- now the compressor will not kick in at all-

what are some good replacement compressor sellers beside autosone?

thanks

dave
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Your car, a 1990LS has a the Nippondenso 10P15C or 10P17C compressor in it.

To be sure, you'll have to examine you compressor.

The compressor for the 90 Legend costs $300.

See here

It may not be the compressor, but the pressure switch. Too much and the compressor won't work, too little, and it won't work.
You have to be between a certain range for the compressor to work.

If you jump the pressure switch, and the compressor comes on, then you may have added too refrigerant or you have a leak and some escaped.

Question about the refrigerant you used - are you sure you used R-32 ?
This type of refrigerant will make you compressor really work and could cause it to fail.
You know that using r-32 may be illegal in your state/province ? It is also flamable !!!
So don't use an electronic leak detector or your system may blow!!! :eek:

If you can get HI and LO pressures, post them.
 

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r32

yes- I used the standard refrigerant sold in auto stores -as part of an upgrade -and I understand it makes the compressor work harder- so i figure it is bound to be the compressor -

How can I jump the pressure switch? jsut jump some of the wires in the switch while it is on?

Is there any other solution to the freon? could I have used the old stuff -so xpensive-

Who can i trust in the A/C repair game- no one around here seems very honest- considering it is August and in Florida any one will pay thru the nose for a/c -

THanks

dave
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Sorry, don't live in Florida, so can't comment.
Go here and post a message to who fellow memebers would recommend in your area.
Chances is that you'll get an unbias opinion there.

There are alternatives, but the concenus on the A/C board, is to go with R-134a since all A/C techs will service that.
Alternatives may cool better, but they may be against the law in certain states.
Also, A/C techs may refuse to service your car if you have anything but R-12 or R-134a in it (may damage their equipment).

I've used Envirosafe for a year, and it worked well. I converted mine over to R-134a this year and it is just as cold as my R-12 & ES-12 systems. I had to tinker with amount of R-134a in the system though.

As for the pressure switch, I have a 93, so it's different.
Mine is located on the tube that connects to the dryer (cylinder thingy with HI/LO lines coming out of it).

The compressor does not turn electrically, it turns mechanically.
The clutch is what you're actually going to be "jumping".

What you want to do if pull off the switch from the HI side line and jump it with a paper clip.
You don't have to start the car to do this, just turn ignition ON - one before you actually start the car.
Jump the switch and you should be able to see (I can for my car) the clutch pull in onto the pully on the compressor.

If you pull off the AC belt, does the pully turn by hand ?
Also does the clutch on the compressor (centre wheel) turn by hand ?

Is there any grinding when one of these are turned ?

If both of these turn by hand, then it may be something else.

Check and post back, I'll do my best to walk you thru.
 

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compressor diagnosis

Thanks much for the jump tip -

I figured the paper clip thing - the high pressure side switch is just above my accumulator as well- attached to the line -

If it is bad then it wont click the clutch over -right-

only thing -there are 4 pins -I assume one for high and one for low pressure -

that link is great- I had called a few parts suppliers and they had the niiponenso compressors for about the same -

I guess the oils used in the comprssor when changing the coolant can conflict and damage the syetem, right?
 

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jumped switch

i jumped the A/C pressure switch and all I get is the fan on the radiator comming on - none of the other jump wires do anything-

so that must be the compressor - right?

thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
For the switch, the four, are like a "cross" or a "plus sign" on mine.
I shorted the horizontal ones. Check with a fellow Legend member who owns a manual to make sure you don't damage something.
(I doubt you will, just covering my a$$) :D

The oils in the compressor and rest of the system are inter-dependant (is that a word ?).
What I mean is, depending on what refrigerant you use, you need to use a specific oil.
For R-12 systems, you can use mineral oil - the standard (or POE oil)
For R-134a, you can use PAG or POE oils, but not mineral oil.
The reason for the different oils, is that the refrigerant is what will move the oil around the system and keep it lubricated.
R-134a cannot move mineral oil, hence, it will sit at the bottom of the evaporator, condenser, rec/dryer etc. This stagnant oil will also reduce cooling, as refrigerant must go around it.

Since you already had your O rings changed, I would find out what type they are as some O rings will not stay lubricated with certain oils and will dry out (causing a leak).
If it matters, go with the oil that the O ring is compatible with, if not use PAG or POE if you are going to go with R-134a.
If you're going to go with a alternative, you should be able to use any of the 3 oils, as most alternatives are compatible with all oils.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Re: jumped switch

dgenchi said:
i jumped the A/C pressure switch and all I get is the fan on the radiator comming on - none of the other jump wires do anything-

so that must be the compressor - right?

thanks
Still a little too early to say it's a definite Yes.

It may be the clutch (this is replacable).

When the car is on, does the A/C belt turn the pulley on the compressor ?

With the car OFF can you trun the centre of the compressor ?
 

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compressor spins freely

yse- with the car off -i can spin the compressor -it feels smooth with a few spots where it is harder to turn -but no rough feel or noise-

and the belt is connected to a turning pulley with the car on -

Before this weekend -the ac would come on and work for a while- mabe 15 min of driving -then click of -so I had to manually turn back on the ac from inside hitting the off then on button on the ac -.. then it would work for another 5 min -then click off again adn maybe once more when i reset it but only for a few seconds of compressor time -then it wouuld disengage the compressor for good- ususally the car would have to sit for a while before it would work again -

I had added what I thought was the correct amount of freon and oil after emptying the system to put a new accumulator in- as well as o-rings-

thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Ok, before you replaced the O rings and other parts and recharge was the system working ?

Do you have a set of guages to post the HI and LO side readings ?

No noise from the pulley would indicate that the bearing are still good. looks like it is the clutch itself.

You say that when you jump the pressure switch, the clutch does not pull in.
You could try to run 12V from the battery straight to the clutch. If it does not pull in when you do this, then it is the clutch coil.
Replacement is not hard, but you'll need a clutch kit (puller) to replace the coil and pull the clutch a part.

Just since you and I never mentioned it, did you check the fuses and relays ?
(I would assume that they are good since when you jumped the pressure switch, the fans came on, but better to check and make sure)
 

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ac

Yes- system worked before- but was low -ran with no blower motor before I bought it -

then replaced orings and accumulator and recharged system - 24 oz of freon and 8 0z of oil

will try the jump of the compressor-

I do have climat conroll digital dash- could that be a factor?
 

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oils in the compressor

if I did not drain the compressor of the old oil -then is it reacting with the new oil and damageing the system?

Can you drain the oil without loosing the coolant?

is there a drain plug?

thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
No, you have to get the refrigerant recovered and then you can take apart your system and drain the oil. Opening up the system like that could cause you injury - remember, the system is under pressure from 50-230+ psi. The refrigerant is also dangerous if it gets into your eyes or if you inhale a large quantity

The oil prevents cooling and may damage the system's internals.
The refrigerant leaving the evaporator is gas going to the compressor and here it will be compressed to a liquid again.
Since the old oil is just sitting there (remember the oil is moved by the refrigerant) it will not compress (ie it is already a liquid) and may seize your compressor (or make it work harder - eventually siezing it).

If you are going to open the system up, then you might as well flush the lines, condenser and evalorator.

From the A/C board I posted about before;
they use brake cleaner to flush and blow out with compressed air. Buy the gallon bottle and flush a few times.

Do not flush the compressor or the rec / dryer / accum with brake fluid.
Flush the compressor with what ever oil you're going to use (PAG, POE, mineral oil).

Then when you put the system back together, put 2oz in the rec/dryer, 5oz in the compressor and 1.5 in the condensor and evaporator eventually it will all be evenly distributed).

I don't think it could be the climate control, because you jumped the pressure switch and the clutch did not pull in. The climate control is the "brains", but we went around that with the paper clip.
 

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opening system

I already opened it once -i first drained it from one of the fill lines -low pressure side and then replaced the rec-dryer-

so basically I have to take out the compressor anyway -and then flu**** and deal with the clutch thing -Called and the parts store I called didn't offer a seperate clutch kit -

then I will have to flush the rest of the system with break cleaner- right?

except the rec-dryer and evap- right/?

then put it all back to gether and add the new oil and coolant again -

If I can t find a seperate compressor clutch -then I guess the best compressor relplacement is the denzo..right//

thanks again

dave
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Try these place for the clutch alone 1 2
For #2, it looks like you need part #32.

I'm not a hard nose, but venting the refrigerant is illegal, a $25000 fine I believe.

You got it on the flushing I would flush the evaporator, but it's up to you, once you put it all back together, you MUST pull a vacuum for a 1/2hr or more to get rid of all the moisture in the lines.
Some refrigerant could explode if mixed with air at a high pressure. Also the refrigerant mixed with air will combine and create an acid that is the main cause of leaks.

When you take off the dryer, put some tape over the holes on the dryer immediately as it will "soak up" the moisture in the air and that unit will basically be useless. I put mine on just before I vacuum the system.

I don't know what other compressor will fit your car, so I'd say stick with Denso.

If you do get a new compressor, make sure you remove the manifold off of the old one.
The manifold is the part/plate that is attached to the compressor and has the connections to attach to the HI and LO lines.
 

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replace

Thanks - I figured as much - -

looks like I should go with the entire relplacement - better in long run -

and all the other steps I will try and do myself except the final vacume adn charge -

thanks again-
 
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