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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys, I am looking to change the suspension on the car for a smoother ride and want to lower the car no more then a inch and a half. This will be my very first time ever lowering or changing the suspension on a car let alone my LEGEND.

My question is, what is everything that I need to change in order to do it right the first time. I have been doing research and I see things for coilover kits, shocks/Struts, sway bars and so on and have become confused as I do not know more then just the basic things in regards to our cars.

I looked on ebay and saw a combo for KYB and some springs… I don’t want to blow too much money, so any help on this would be well apriciated… I know that there have been many posts in regards to this, I have read a few, but none that I have read said anything in regards to everything that needs to be changed….

I use the car daily and would like something dependable, nothing to complicate the car as I have my daughter with me in the car all of the time, something that will allow the car better handling. I am trying to learn what everything is for, such as sway bay, pullies, and other things….. Bare with me guys….. See ya at the meet hopefully with new shocks and the car nicely lowered…
 

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Blackend Motorsports
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Hey guys, I am looking to change the suspension on the car for a smoother ride and want to lower the car no more then a inch and a half. This will be my very first time ever lowering or changing the suspension on a car let alone my LEGEND.

My question is, what is everything that I need to change in order to do it right the first time. I have been doing research and I see things for coilover kits, shocks/Struts, sway bars and so on and have become confused as I do not know more then just the basic things in regards to our cars.

I looked on ebay and saw a combo for KYB and some springs… I don't want to blow too much money, so any help on this would be well apriciated… I know that there have been many posts in regards to this, I have read a few, but none that I have read said anything in regards to everything that needs to be changed….

I use the car daily and would like something dependable, nothing to complicate the car as I have my daughter with me in the car all of the time, something that will allow the car better handling. I am trying to learn what everything is for, such as sway bay, pullies, and other things….. Bare with me guys….. See ya at the meet hopefully with new shocks and the car nicely lowered…
Ok - first things first, when you lower a car, the ride will get stiffer than OEM simply because you're cramming the same dampening force into a smaller space. That being said, when I lowered my coupe on H&R springs and Koni red shocks, I didn't notice that much of a difference in the ride...it was a little stiffer, but not too much. In fact, after about a month, I forgot it wasn't OEM ride quality.

Second, if you're looking to do it on the cheap, don't. Save more money and buy a quality setup the first time. KYB/Monroe/etc. are designed as OEM replacement shocks and are not set up to handle lowering springs for any length of time. Koni red's (or yellow as they come in the sport kit) are designed to handle lowering springs, and should be exactly what you're looking for.

If you're wanting a decent drop...nothing too aggressive, I would suggest Ground Control sleeves for the Koni's since they will give you adjustability in ride height (also allowing you to compensate for any uneven drop as these cars are prone to experience) and still pair with Eibach springs for a close-to-OEM ride. If you want to cheap-o out on these, you can buy Eibach springs but you may end up with an uneven stance like a lot of other members have had. Eibach springs are good for a little over 1" drop all around, and you can get another .75" out of the Koni's if you desire.

Let me know if you have other questions, or if I didn't quite answer what you needed.
 

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As a fellow NY member and as a guy who came from different suspension setups from different cars (coilovers to springs/shocks, etc...) here is my $.02:

1) being that you are from the BX and daily drive NYC streets, I would advise against lowering just simply for the pothole factor....the car rides harsh enough over our potholes...lowering it will make them more pronounced and then your daughter will claim the car rides too rough or bouncy
2) the only good way to lower a car is with coilovers. lowering springs simply reduce suspension travel, creating more of tendency to bottom out over bumps. Unfortunately, NYC streets don't condone themselves to coilovers (you will get ALOT of banging, clanking, rattles, squeaks)
 

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Sway bars control one side of the suspension relative to the other in an effort to keep the car flat (ie. reduce body roll) when cornering. This is a great part, but doesn't make things any smoother.

Strut tower bars like the IDS bar and MLS bar are frame support. They are meant to make sure that the forces from the springs and struts are acting on a solid platform. This will improve comfort over bad bumps (adding to a more sure-footed feeling) and will improve the suspension's ability to do its thing when handling.

Tie bars are similar to the strut tower bars but they operate on the rear end.

Tires make a difference too... a tire with a stiff side-wall will not give when a bump is hit: this reduces comfort. This also applies to larger diameter rims as they basically act as a completely immovable sidewall and provide lots of support but zero cushion.

Springs and struts compliment one another to provide control of the car as it goes over bumps. The spring is there to move: the movement provides the cushion you feel when you hit a bump or fall into a pot hole. The strut controls the motion of the spring: without it, you'd hit a bump and the spring would bounce up and down over and over again (very uncomfortable!) These parts are complicated because you can be over-spring (tending toward too much movement) or over-damp (tending toward snapping into place and not letting the spring move much) rather easily. Most spring strut pairs suffer from this (I believe over-damp is preferable as it's more comfortable and more controllable).

The most comfortable (ie. softest, won't hurt your ass when you hit things) solution is OEM. It's most likely that the only thing you'll need to replace here are the struts (the springs, unless sagging, shouldn't need to be replaced).

If you're looking for firmness, support, and control... a stiffer suspension may be construed as more comfortable. For example, I find my stock suspension to be too soft now that I'm used to my M3s suspension: I find the amount of movement the car does when cornering and on rough road uncomfortable (it doesn't feel sure-footed: I don't like that). In this territory, one generally replaces the struts and springs. Koni is the way to go here (some say KYB will work here or as a stock replacement but I've seen nothing that suggests the KYBs will last anywhere near as well as the Koni or OEM solutions: throw down once now and it'll be a lot cheaper than doing it again in a couple years.) For moderate drop, a Koni Pro Kit (I believe it's konis struts with Eibach springs?) may be the best solution.

You can also do Konis on OEM springs... but you won't get much drop out of them.

Coilovers are the most extreme solution. Generally, a coilover is a damper matched to the springs and sold as a single assembly. This is a 100% handling solution. If you're willing to sacrifice comfort for the ability to corner, this is your option. In doing this, you'll also want to learn about suspension adjustability.


So... what should you replace? It depends. Are your OEM shocks blown? How many miles do they have on them? What tires and size rims are you running?

Off the bat, I'm inclined to recommend a Koni Sport kit, fresh ball joints and a good alignment. Good tires are a must too... from there, I'd do the MLS bar, then the rear sway bar (if not both) and finally, tie bars.

Oh, and an engine dampener, just 'cause Blackend can always use the support :lol:

Oh, and BTW: someone fix whatever I've pooched in that explanation.
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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757 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Sway bars control one side of the suspension relative to the other in an effort to keep the car flat (ie. reduce body roll) when cornering. This is a great part, but doesn't make things any smoother.

Strut tower bars like the IDS bar and MLS bar are frame support. They are meant to make sure that the forces from the springs and struts are acting on a solid platform. This will improve comfort over bad bumps (adding to a more sure-footed feeling) and will improve the suspension's ability to do its thing when handling.

Tie bars are similar to the strut tower bars but they operate on the rear end.

Tires make a difference too... a tire with a stiff side-wall will not give when a bump is hit: this reduces comfort. This also applies to larger diameter rims as they basically act as a completely immovable sidewall and provide lots of support but zero cushion.

Springs and struts compliment one another to provide control of the car as it goes over bumps. The spring is there to move: the movement provides the cushion you feel when you hit a bump or fall into a pot hole. The strut controls the motion of the spring: without it, you'd hit a bump and the spring would bounce up and down over and over again (very uncomfortable!) These parts are complicated because you can be over-spring (tending toward too much movement) or over-damp (tending toward snapping into place and not letting the spring move much) rather easily. Most spring strut pairs suffer from this (I believe over-damp is preferable as it's more comfortable and more controllable).

The most comfortable (ie. softest, won't hurt your ass when you hit things) solution is OEM. It's most likely that the only thing you'll need to replace here are the struts (the springs, unless sagging, shouldn't need to be replaced).

If you're looking for firmness, support, and control... a stiffer suspension may be construed as more comfortable. For example, I find my stock suspension to be too soft now that I'm used to my M3s suspension: I find the amount of movement the car does when cornering and on rough road uncomfortable (it doesn't feel sure-footed: I don't like that). In this territory, one generally replaces the struts and springs. Koni is the way to go here (some say KYB will work here or as a stock replacement but I've seen nothing that suggests the KYBs will last anywhere near as well as the Koni or OEM solutions: throw down once now and it'll be a lot cheaper than doing it again in a couple years.) For moderate drop, a Koni Pro Kit (I believe it's konis struts with Eibach springs?) may be the best solution.

You can also do Konis on OEM springs... but you won't get much drop out of them.

Coilovers are the most extreme solution. Generally, a coilover is a damper matched to the springs and sold as a single assembly. This is a 100% handling solution. If you're willing to sacrifice comfort for the ability to corner, this is your option. In doing this, you'll also want to learn about suspension adjustability.

So... what should you replace? It depends. Are your OEM shocks blown? How many miles do they have on them? What tires and size rims are you running?

Off the bat, I'm inclined to recommend a Koni Sport kit, fresh ball joints and a good alignment. Good tires are a must too... from there, I'd do the MLS bar, then the rear sway bar (if not both) and finally, tie bars.

Oh, and an engine dampener, just 'cause Blackend can always use the support :lol:

Oh, and BTW: someone fix whatever I've pooched in that explanation.
A,

Thanks for the time you put to answer me, that means a lot to me... Well, there is nothing wrong with my shocks and springs, they are fine.. I just wanted a smoother ride compared to a BMW or Lexus.... I drove my Firends Lexus and it was smooth as hell, we went down a road that I feel every bump with the Legend and hardly felt anything....

I want a smoother ride when it comes to feeling bumps, I have all OEM, the only thing is that I have GS Rims on my LS..

Sounds like I may need a MLS bar.... What else do you think I can change for a smoother ride? Where can I get a good MLS bar?

Can someone drive my Legend at the meet and let me drive theirs to see if there is a difference?
 

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A,

Thanks for the time you put to answer me, that means a lot to me... Well, there is nothing wrong with my shocks and springs, they are fine.. I just wanted a smoother ride compared to a BMW or Lexus.... I drove my Firends Lexus and it was smooth as hell, we went down a road that I feel every bump with the Legend and hardly felt anything....

I want a smoother ride when it comes to feeling bumps, I have all OEM, the only thing is that I have GS Rims on my LS..

Sounds like I may need a MLS bar.... What else do you think I can change for a smoother ride? Where can I get a good MLS bar?

Can someone drive my Legend at the meet and let me drive theirs to see if there is a difference?
you can drive mine if you want, it has brand new Monroe Sensitrac shocks...

but I'll just warn you, if you've never been to Jones Beach, Ocean Parkway is very very very smooth.....you'll be hardpressed to find a choppy road to really test a suspension out...
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
you can drive mine if you want, it has brand new Monroe Sensitrac shocks...

but I'll just warn you, if you've never been to Jones Beach, Ocean Parkway is very very very smooth.....you'll be hardpressed to find a choppy road to really test a suspension out...
I just want to be able to see if mine drives funny or all of our cars drive the way that mine does..... I would love to drive your man... Thanks so much for the offer.... I will look out for you....
 

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I just want to be able to see if mine drives funny or all of our cars drive the way that mine does..... I would love to drive your man... Thanks so much for the offer.... I will look out for you....
yeah man, you can't miss me....im gonna be the only red-headed white guy there, :lol:

plus, if you are coming from the BX, chances are ur poppin over the throgs neck...I'm literally 1 exit off the clearview expressway...you can meet up with me before in my neck of the woods, we can drive each others rides and u can follow me and whomever else over to the beach, :thumbsup:
 

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A,

Thanks for the time you put to answer me, that means a lot to me... Well, there is nothing wrong with my shocks and springs, they are fine.. I just wanted a smoother ride compared to a BMW or Lexus.... I drove my Firends Lexus and it was smooth as hell, we went down a road that I feel every bump with the Legend and hardly felt anything....

I want a smoother ride when it comes to feeling bumps, I have all OEM, the only thing is that I have GS Rims on my LS..

Sounds like I may need a MLS bar.... What else do you think I can change for a smoother ride? Where can I get a good MLS bar?

Can someone drive my Legend at the meet and let me drive theirs to see if there is a difference?
Given that you're basically on the smoothest setup for the Legend, I think you'll be hard pressed to isolate yourself further from the road than you already are: the Lexus feel is designed to be softer and more isolated than your Legend which is intended to maintain a slightly sportier feel...

That's not to say it's hopeless though. I'm curious what sort of tires you're running?

I'd recommend a set of OEM 15s with supple rubber first (I refuse to get rid of the stock MXV4 rubber for exactly this reason: they feel WONDERFUL to me on the highway.)

Also, given the age and likely the miles you have on the suspension, it's highly likely that the rubber bushings that play some part in the isolation behaviors of the suspension are likely stiff at best (you're lucky if they're not cracked, torn, in really sad shape: mine aren't pretty, I know that!)

Unfortunately, Acura doesn't do you any favors in this department as fresh bushings are only sold from the dealer in the control arms... you can't buy them alone. This makes for a pretty significant investment (not only in parts but the labor costs aren't wildly different either). If you're REALLY aching to spend some money to fix the problem, I'd consider new bushings...

As suspensions age, they do get a little less comfortable as well... but if you're not seeing leaks or sagging springs, you shouldn't be in terrible shape... I'm not sure that you'd notice a big difference by refreshing the springs and struts but again, if you're really looking to drop coin for the best example of OEM Legend smoothness, new OEM springs and struts may help...

Though really, as much as it pains me to say it (mind you I mean zero disrespect)... at the end of the day, you might want to consider saving for a Lexus if that sort of isolation is what you're after :(
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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757 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
yeah man, you can't miss me....im gonna be the only red-headed white guy there, :lol:

plus, if you are coming from the BX, chances are ur poppin over the throgs neck...I'm literally 1 exit off the clearview expressway...you can meet up with me before in my neck of the woods, we can drive each others rides and u can follow me and whomever else over to the beach, :thumbsup:
Yeah, that would be cool, I will let you know for sure....

Given that you're basically on the smoothest setup for the Legend, I think you'll be hard pressed to isolate yourself further from the road than you already are: the Lexus feel is designed to be softer and more isolated than your Legend which is intended to maintain a slightly sportier feel...

That's not to say it's hopeless though. I'm curious what sort of tires you're running?

I'd recommend a set of OEM 15s with supple rubber first (I refuse to get rid of the stock MXV4 rubber for exactly this reason: they feel WONDERFUL to me on the highway.)

Also, given the age and likely the miles you have on the suspension, it's highly likely that the rubber bushings that play some part in the isolation behaviors of the suspension are likely stiff at best (you're lucky if they're not cracked, torn, in really sad shape: mine aren't pretty, I know that!)

Unfortunately, Acura doesn't do you any favors in this department as fresh bushings are only sold from the dealer in the control arms... you can't buy them alone. This makes for a pretty significant investment (not only in parts but the labor costs aren't wildly different either). If you're REALLY aching to spend some money to fix the problem, I'd consider new bushings...

As suspensions age, they do get a little less comfortable as well... but if you're not seeing leaks or sagging springs, you shouldn't be in terrible shape... I'm not sure that you'd notice a big difference by refreshing the springs and struts but again, if you're really looking to drop coin for the best example of OEM Legend smoothness, new OEM springs and struts may help...

Though really, as much as it pains me to say it (mind you I mean zero disrespect)... at the end of the day, you might want to consider saving for a Lexus if that sort of isolation is what you're after :(
It is something to think about, but I can never give up on the LEGEND, it's like the first born, you just don't give up on them no matter what kind of drug addict they become....lol
 

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Yeah, that would be cool, I will let you know for sure....

It is something to think about, but I can never give up on the LEGEND, it's like the first born, you just don't give up on them no matter what kind of drug addict they become....lol
You're preaching to choir buddy: I'm the one with a toy car that I love and I STILL spent my car budget and my free time last weekend arm deep in my Legend. :yes:

But that's only because the toy was in the shop for paint :rofl:

EDIT: thought up another solution... move someplace where the roads are smoother :rofl:
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
You're preaching to choir buddy: I'm the one with a toy car that I love and I STILL spent my car budget and my free time last weekend arm deep in my Legend. :yes:

But that's only because the toy was in the shop for paint :rofl:

EDIT: thought up another solution... move someplace where the roads are smoother :rofl:
Yeah, I am going to buy a Tar Flattener and put some LEGEND emblems on it…. How smooth will that be…..:rofl:
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I have michelin Energy tires on which I just bought brand new....
So what is the best thing for me to do? I am NY, and it is true, not the best thing to do when it comes to lowering it, So what shocks are the best to get to work with the OEM springs for a less bumpy ride?
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Koni Red's?

I have michelin Energy tires on which I just bought brand new....
So what is the best thing for me to do? I am NY, and it is true, not the best thing to do when it comes to lowering it, So what shocks are the best to get to work with the OEM springs for a less bumpy ride?
Okay so I was looking and found Koni Reds Special, can these work with the OEM springs? How does it work, is soft to feel less bumps?
 

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Im in NYC as well, with ksport coil overs. You definetly dont wont these, there are times when the rear tires go airborne cuz the suspension is so stiff and the bumps around here are out of control. and thats at 25% stiffness. However its a very nice ride when you find a nice strech of curvy roads...
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Im in NYC as well, with ksport coil overs. You definetly dont wont these, there are times when the rear tires go airborne cuz the suspension is so stiff and the bumps around here are out of control. and thats at 25% stiffness. However its a very nice ride when you find a nice strech of curvy roads...
Can you please tell me what is the difference between shocks and coil overs?

Can you put coil overs on the OEM set up?

Thanks for the info man...
 

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coilovers are a spring/strut all in one combo that is adjustable in both ride height and dampening. (ride comfort). (which replaces your OEM suspension of separate springs and struts) A strut is just that, a strut. Springs have to go around struts. With struts u get lowering springs if you want your ride lower and stiffer.

A coilover is a true race bred suspension-at least the ones i'm familiar with. Yes you can adjust it to be more soft, but more soft turns out to be more bouncy. Stiffer just rattles ur kidneys over bumps.

NYC is just not practical for coilover suspensions. Long Island is better, but you need states like FL, CA, TX, etc to really enjoy their capabilities (basically anywhere u can get nothing but nice paved roads, without potholes caused from nasty winter salt/sand and huge Mack tractors :lol:
 

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GS Hog
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divinchi, I don't think that there's much you can do to make the car feel more like a Lexus. As was mentioned before, the Lexus was designed that way. The Legend was designed the way it is intentionally. Aftermarket components available will at best be similar to the Legend's stock ride, but is more likely to stiffen the ride whether it be a little or a lot.
 

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93 LEGEND LS 3.5L
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757 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
divinchi, I don't think that there's much you can do to make the car feel more like a Lexus. As was mentioned before, the Lexus was designed that way. The Legend was designed the way it is intentionally. Aftermarket components available will at best be similar to the Legend's stock ride, but is more likely to stiffen the ride whether it be a little or a lot.
Okay, well I am not too sure what to do then... I am feeling every bump really hard lately, more then before..... It really shakes the car hard....

What options do I have, if Konis are not good for the city, what options will be better then stock for the Legend in order to not feel the bumps hard, and I am very good at avoiding bumps, but some are not as easy to avoid....
 
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